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Stein Online Show Interview
with Cynthia Sue Larson

by Elliot Stein
on November 17, 1999
Page 2 of 4

ES: As usual, at our half-way point, we'll take some questions about our very metaphysical discussion today, reality shifts. And again I will give the web site here at the front of the show.


Will take you over to the site of reality shifts. You can get a lot of good information about what it's all about. Now let's get some examples, if we can, since you have put this up on the internet, of any astonishing reality shifts experiences that people have said have happened to them.

CSL: I'm glad you asked me about that, too. I've gotten tremendous response from all around the world from people who've told me about their reality shifts, and they range just all over the place. Several of them have reminded me of things that have happened to me. I'm not going out to people and putting them through lie-detector tests or anything, because basically what I'm hearing about seems quite along the lines of things of things that have happened in my life. One example that just came in the other day was about a person named Ray who was at a gas station. He'd been attending some kind of a spiritual workshop, where he'd been exposed to lots of great energy and great ideas and he was feeling very loving and filled with joy. As he walked to the gas station, he reached in his pocket, or was getting ready to pay the person who worked in the gas station. He noticed that the bills to pay the person were coming into being right in his hand, and the change was, too. He knew when the handful of coins just appeared in his hand, that would be the right amount of change to pay, and it was. He had the sensation that basically, the person behind the counter might not remember this. That's also something that I've noticed; it seems like some people are aware of what's going on, and some people for some reason just don't notice that anything unusual happened.

ES: Well, let me throw in something here... I've had a few things happen in my life, and one of them just totally freaked me out here. Those of you from the 70's know what the term "freak me out means", you become frazzled because of the result of something occurring. Let me tell you this, because you'll find this very astonishing, Cynthia, and I know the audience will as well. The only time that I watch a football game is the Super Bowl. It's the only game I watch of football. I turn it on just to get a sense of the antics, the sideshow, and the clever commercials. Everything that's going on other than the football game, basically. So that's once a year I turn that on. Well, one day... this is probably about four years ago... you know, cable television now, you can in some places get sixty or seventy channels and stuff, and I was going through them Wham, Wham, Wham, Wham, Wham... and I happened to stop at what was a Monday night or Tuesday night football game that was being telecast on some station. I don't know what or who was playing. And for whatever reason, where I stopped, the camera was at the angle from way back showing a long distance.. it was a night game... whatever stadium they were in, they had a huge bank of lights. It was like something like I had never seen before. Maybe stadiums are different in how much lighting they put up around, but this one was a bank of lights. Maybe there was, who knows, maybe fifty lights by a fifty light grid. When they pulled back, it caught your attention. I wondered what would happen... I'm looking at this night football game, which obviously they are dependent on. I thought, "What would happen if those lights went out?" The minute I thought that... the SECOND, not the minute... the second I thought that, WHAM, there was an explosion on those lights.... they had to shut the game down

CSL: Wow...

ES:... for twenty minutes. Can I say I was freaked out?

CSL: Yes!

ES: I had this bizarre thought... which was, "Look at how bright that is?" Obviously millions of people who are there in the stadium and millions who are watching at home, I don't know if that's what they were thinking, but I was. I thought, "Gee those lights are extraordinary, and look at the way they are structured. I wonder what would happen if they went out?" And there was an explosion, and the game had to be called for twenty minutes while they went up and fixed the generators and things of that nature. I don't know if I am the responsible party for having made that happen that day, but it was an awfully strange coincidence because that was the only thought I had. I wasn't thinking about "Oh, look at the cheerleaders!", and I wasn't thinking, "Gee... what teams are playing?" I was totally focused on these lights, and my one thought that was going through my head, was "Just look at those and the way they are structured! How could they even play the game if those all of the sudden just went out?" WHAM! Just like that, they went out!

CSL: Something that occurs to me, Eliot, when you mention this story, and that is that probably other people watching TV -- due to the way the cameraman was angling around -- might have had a similar thought. When you get that many people watching a game with that thought in mind, that can definitely change reality.

ES: Well, it's possible that here I'm randomly going through the stations... the first thing I noticed was, "LOOK at those bright lights!" Maybe others all around the nation were going, "Gee... what would happen if those lights went out?" and all of us sent out our sort of trickster philosophy. I couldn't believe it. It was one of the weirdest things that's ever happened to me. But I've got some other ones, folks. I've had some odd things, I've got to say. We are talking to Cynthia Sue Larson. She is the webmaster of Reality Shifts. This is a website that looks into a theory involving everything from our minds controlling physical and metaphysical principles and physical objects. We get into synchronicity and everything from prayer to wishful thinking... a lot of interesting things. We'll go to your questions at the halfway point in the program. OK, give us another one from someone who has come up to your site and said, "I've got to share this story about something unusual that happened that I believe is a reality shifts situation."

CSL: OK, this is another one that's very similar to what's happened to me, and happened to a friend of mine. This has to do with a car that seems to unlock itself. This comes from Eric in Canada. This happened to him in June of this year. He was helping his brother carry some stuff with the minivan. They were loading the car, and they have kids who were just climbing in and out the front door. So they decided to lock all the doors. If you have children, then you know how much easier it is if you contain what you're doing. So they did that, and left the back gate open on the car. The car was all packed; there was no way the kids could get to the front seats from the rear. When they came back to the car, it was all totally locked up. They came back to open the front door to get ready for the trip... and when they tried the door.... there was something about going back to the house to get the keys... when they returned, the children were inside the car. Both Eric and his brother were very puzzled about what happened. They asked the children how they got inside, and they said, "Well, we just pulled the handle and got in. How else?"

That was something I just thought was beautiful, because I've also had an experience with my car where I was camping and locked everything up, and went away and came back. One of the doors in the back, which was not even a door I was using, was unlocked. I was very mystified by this. I locked it, and shut the door. When you're camping, you don't want the car being unlocked. I carried some more things to the tent, and came back to the car, and this time the other back door was open. It did that about three or four times, and there were no children involved. I could see that the car seemed to be unlocking itself. Nothing ever happened before or since.

ES: Well, do we have angels at all, playing a role in all of this?

CSL: Well, some people think we do, and once again I can't really tell you for sure that I know what's happening. I can just describe the stories that we have, and I'm able to talk about physics a little bit, because I do have a background in physics. I went to UC Berkeley and studied physics there, and I got a bachelor's degree in physics there. My natural tendency is to want to investigate with physics first, to get a sense of what do we know about the world, and what kind of assumptions are we making about reality. When I do that, what I've noticed is that we seem to have some assumptions which color the way we view the world, so that we're very surprised when things move around. These basic assumptions have been overturned by quantum physics, but a lot of us haven't noticed that, and we continue using these very ancient assumptions. Those really old assumptions, there are four of them:

There's objectivity, where we think that we can observe things without having any effect on them. Like you can just watch a football game, and you won't see the lights turning off. You wouldn't expect that!

The second one would be causality, which means that if you know the causes, then you can figure out what the effects will be.

The third one is locality, which means you only have an effect on something right in front of you. You can't change something that's way across the country, in a football stadium, for example.

And then the last one would be material monism, which is that everything that happens has a material basis.

What's happened with quantum physics is that we've seen these four assumptions are pretty much completely invalid, because we've noticed with a number of different experiments that particles have both a wave and a particle-like nature. The behavior of these quantum particles is very strange. Basically, they seem to be very interconnected. Different quantum particles can move simultaneously. If you affect one and there's a twin particle, you'll see that the twin particle is affected at exactly the same time and exactly the same way. And then there's a definite non-local tendency... it seems that like I just said, there can be a particle that's quite a distance away that's affected. And it seems that mind and matter are unified by consciousness, and it also seems that we can make changes in a very probabilistic way. You can say that most things like chairs and buildings are there, and they will remain there, and look pretty much like they always look, but there's always an off chance that something might change. And that's a probability. And that seems to hold true on the very macro scale, which I think is very interesting. And it seems like it's a natural thing that you would expect when you start looking at our world as composed of many different dimensions... many more than three.

ES: Well, certainly on this program, we have discussed a fourth dimension being time. I don't know about a fifth or sixth -- I don't think we have a name for them yet, but maybe there are.

CSL: There's an excellent book on this, which I Td recommend to everybody in the audience tonight, and it's called THE ELEGANT UNIVERSE, by Brian Greene. In this book, he's got really nice examples that are easy for the layman to understand, such as looking at a two-dimensional universe which then has a third dimension curled into it. You can consider a curled, short dimension to look something like a garden hose, where the long part of the hose is a very easy-to-see dimension, where if you're some distance away, it looks like a straight line. But if you happen to be an ant that is climbing on that hose, you notice there is actually a curled dimension that you can walk around. And it's possible that when we're seeing things move around, we're noticing these curled dimensions, and the effects that fall out of that.

ES: Well, what does science say about reality shifts? Or do they?

CSL: I haven't seen too much written about it. It's mostly anecdotal stories at this point, where I've seen authors such as Michael Talbot mention that he'd seen reality shift, and other authors mention the term in passing. In fact, I was hoping that someone had written a book about this, because I was noticing so many shifts in reality that I wanted to research it and find out more. I was very disappointed to find that there isn't that much written on the subject. There are books like PARALLEL UNIVERSES by Fred Alan Wolf, and then that HOLOGRAPHIC UNIVERSE book I mentioned by Michael Talbot. But basically there isn't that much written about the way that we change things. There are books on manifestation, but I haven't seen very much in the way of tying together both the science and spirituality of this. I think it's fascinating, though!

ES: Yes, well it certainly is. The forerunner of reality shifts was talk about synchronicity, which I think was popular over the past ten years or so.

CSL: Right.

ES: And now, I think it's coming a little further with this theory, and you've even given it a name, reality shifts. I guess you could have called it, what... material objects change? Well, reality shifts sounds better.

CSL: Yes, it's got a ring to it. And it covers everything, because I've seen time slow down, too. You were mentioning time earlier, and that's a very interesting kind of reality shift to observe.

ES: In what kind of case would time slow down?

CSL: In such a way that you can either notice it, or not notice it. I've had both kinds of experiences. In one case, I was in a train station, and my daughter was riding piggyback on my husband's shoulder. She was bouncing along, and waving her arms out to the sides, not really holding on to him, but sort of flopping along, sort of loosely. He was walking, carrying two suitcases, so he couldn't really hold on to her with his suitcase and hers. I was behind them, and I started to get a little bit concerned because my daughter was a very small infant, and it looked like she might get loose and fall down. I don't know how far behind I was, but there was a ridiculously large gap between us. There was no way that I could catch her, if she started to fall. I was just starting to think about that, when in fact she did start to fall. She started going backwards, without anything to hold onto. It looked like her head was going to go straight down for the marble floor. I was just wishing that I could catch her in time. That's the last conscious thought that I remember. I started moving, and I thought I was moving normally, but all the sound around me started changing -- it started seeming like sort of a (low noise) -- the frequency of sound was going down. I noticed that things were slowing down around me, and it was very easy for me to cross this big distance between where I'd been standing or walking, and I caught her easily, and then everything sped back up again. That was really amazing!

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